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Large MPVs -- Ford Galaxy / VW Sharan / SEAT Alhambra: => Ford Galaxy / VW Sharan / SEAT Alhambra => Topic started by: mrhiviz on July 24, 2018, 10:28:11 AM

Title: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 24, 2018, 10:28:11 AM
Hi Again. Luverly weather!

Following on from my clutch replacement issues, (Success!) the poor old thing is a non starter for the first time ever in over 4 years of ownership, (bar a diesel freeze last winter.)

The Clutch went on 3 June and it has been sitting on Axle stands since then after a major parts delivery problem.
I have researched this issue before posting and have tried the following.

One or other original keys into ignition: Door LED comes on and goes off after a couple of seconds. I have never had a key problem.

Engine Turns over strongly,"fires" and immediately stops.
Tried to purge fuel via return between pump and filter. There is fuel. I don't have a vacuum pump so used a clean oil suction gun aginst a lot of resistance.

Tried switching on and off 10 or more times. After each switch off, I hear a click and a small whoosh. (Injector rail decompressing?)

Tried turning over for 15 seconds at a time.

I have checked all connections and refitted ECM. Nothing obviously untoward. All the unplugged connections were around the battery tray.

VCDS Lite: MAF issue as below. 

VCDS-Lite Version: Release 1.2
Scan: 25,01,02,03,08,09,15,16,17,18,19,22,29,35,36,37,39,45,55,56,76
 Address 01: Engine       Labels: 038-906-019-AJM.LBL
   Controller: 038 906 019 LR
   Component: 1,9l R4 EDC 0001SG  1565
   Coding: 00002
   Shop #: WSC 00020
   VCID: 729759CB2DB7
1 Fault Found:
17552 -  Mass Air Flow Sensor (G70): Open or Short to Ground
            P1144 - 35-00 -   -
Readiness: N/A
As no engine light has ever come on and there has never been any indication of a problem, such as poor running or tickover, I don't know if this is a new problem with a connection or not. I didn't think a MAF could stop the car from starting.
I think I will research how to check power flow through pins. Would a careful clean with acetone possibly solve this problem or should I splash out on a new MAF and swap it out.

Other issues with car which aren't likely to be connected.
Drivers door wiring recently became erratic and as yet unrepaired.
ABS offline due to intermittent fault on one wheel I can't pin down. Had this problem for a couple of years.
AC compressor unplugged due to broken pipework.
When removing the gearbox, I couldn't find the speed sensor to unplug it and searched for ages. When I got the box out I found the mounting on top but can only assume it was never connected. (I would definitely have seen the wiring.)

Well,  I am just wondering if there something simples that someone out there has done when faced with the same problem.

I'm gutted because the whole clutch system feels fantastic for the first time ever and I can't test it!!!!

I am nearly ready to find a small branch for a bloody good thrashing but I don't think The car or I deserve it.  :-\

Cheers and a good day to all.

L




Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: Chrispb on July 24, 2018, 11:06:48 AM
Starting and immediately stopping is usually because the chip in the key hasn't been recognized by the car, have you dropped the keys recently or opened up key to replace battery and chips fallen out?

You said LED comes on the goes out when you turn on ignition but what happens when operating starter?

Maf code can be from running engine with Maf disconnected, clear code and monitor.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 25, 2018, 09:30:05 AM
Hi Chris

Thanks for your reply.

Resetting VCDS brings up same MAF fault. Maybe it will clear if The car runs.

Keys have been OK up to now. (Never opened.) I have one remote key and one non remote, which I assume is the original

The LED just comes on and goes out and stays out when starting. (The LED had never worked since I bought the car until I stripped out the door and found it hadn't been connected up.

I will follow this line of enquiry and research key coding on the forum. Maybe the long unintended lay up has caused the problem.

Thanks very much.



L



Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 25, 2018, 10:58:18 AM
So Far...

 I opened up key to check and the chip is there. (Great design where the chip could get lost so easily!)

 Apart from the minor issue of the car not starting, :) it would appear that the the immobiliser sytem and keys seem to be functioning in principle inside the car. I think LED does what it should, goes out, no flashing etc. The remote locking works as well. There are issues there because of the broken door wiring but I don't think the non starting is a progression from that problem.

I opened up fusebox panels just to check there wasn't a connector around steering column or earth that had been missed after the strip out for the master cylinder. Just seems like a major loom with no visible connections.

How does the immobiliser prevent further firing of the motor? does it cut power to injectors?

Can I safely assume that the MAF sensor fault shouldn't prevent starting? I am going to try and inspect and clean it this morning. Hopefully that is just a coincidence.

If the car is firing momentarily, can I also assume that it is not air in fuel? I have read about people bleeding injectors on "other" sites is this worthwhile and/or safe?

 I read up on key programming on here and in the manual. This seems to be primarily for extra keys.  Can I verify the original 2 keys with the same procedure?

I am sure that this problem is associated with being laid up for far longer than expected (forgotten keys or air in fuel) or my own electrical buffoonery!!

I stilll have visions of John Cleese and the Austin 1100!

Thanks

L

Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: johnnyroper on July 25, 2018, 12:30:54 PM
The MAF will not stop it from starting the VAG 1.9pd will run quite happily with it disconnected.
I had similar sort of thing with an Audi A3 it would fire and die straight away and that turned out to be cam sensor at fault but did not log a fault.
As it fires I would rule out air in fuel as that will cause long crank but would eventually fire up.

Have you double checked all wiring on engine to make sure everything is back and nothing unplugged while doing the work?
Are earths connevted and good on engine? Maybe to rule that out run a jump lead from battery neg to a good piece of metal on the engine?
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 25, 2018, 02:53:02 PM
Hi Johnny.

Thanks for your ideas.

I have double checked all the connections as far as I know. Jump lead trick (Neg to alternator bracket) gives no joy so I assume that rules out earthing problem? I am going to take the battery tray out again and have another good look below. I'm going to have a good look behind engine again in case something got caught up when doing clutch cylinder.

As I posted earlier, gearbox speed sensor must have been missing all along as I couldn't see any lead anywhere to disconnect when i was taking the box out.

I have cleaned up the MAF anyway for what it's worth. I'm wondering if the open/short fault is a sympton of a loose connection.

I am going to take the battery tray out again and have another good look below.

Thanks to you both so far....
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on July 25, 2018, 06:57:18 PM
As far as i know the gearbox speed sensor isn't used on the mk2, the mk1 does use it (at least mine did!), the mk2 uses the ABS sensors to pickup the road speed if its fitted (don't know if any mk2s don't have ABS, but it might be used in that case, my mk1 didn't have ABS).

I'd be having a look round the crank sensor if you haven't already done so, just incase its either been damaged during the clutch swap, got covered in debris from the failed clutch or just not connected as well as it should be.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 26, 2018, 10:15:27 AM
Thanks Brian.

Glad I was right about the grearbox sensor. One less thing to worry about.

I am in the middle of removing the crank sensor. It is very dirty down there with a mixture of Oil and old degraded foam engine shroud, which I have now discarded.

I will put everything back and report.

I am very grateful to you all for your advice and guidance. Due to various logistical issues and supplier problems, it has been 55 days since we towed the poor old thing home. It is our only car and we have been managing on our bicycles, loan and hire cars and Shank's pony!

I'm just looking forward to the day when it purrs into life as it has done for the last four years! :)

Cheers

L




Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 26, 2018, 03:20:44 PM
Hi.

crank sensor out and cleaned up. got a resistance reading of .5 k ohm across two of the pins. (haven't recorded which. will re do.) Not sure what to look for to verify if faulty.

It will take a few days to get hold of a replacement.

I now have 2 engine faults on VCDS. second one is not on pdf list of codes. (p1672) I am going to register vcds when i have recovered from the current outlay on the car!


VCDS-Lite Version: Release 1.2
Thursday, 26 July 2018, 16:03:04.


Chassis Type: FG - Ford Galaxy
Scan: 25,01,02,03,08,09,15,16,17,18,19,22,29,35,36,37,39,45,55,56,76
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine       Labels: 038-906-019-AJM.LBL
   Controller: 038 906 019 LR
   Component: 1,9l R4 EDC 0001SG  1565
   Coding: 00002
   Shop #: WSC 00020
   VCID: 729759CB2DB7
2 Faults Found:
17552 -  Mass Air Flow Sensor (G70): Open or Short to Ground
            P1144 - 35-00 -   -
18080 - Shareware Version. To Decode all DTCs
            P1672 - 35-00 - Please Register/Activate
Readiness: N/A

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes       Labels: 1J0-907-37x-ABS.LBL
   Controller: 7M3 907 379 G
   Component: ABS FRONT MK25      0102
   Coding: 0007689
   Shop #: WSC 00020
   VCID: 41F5C6075891
2 Faults Found:
00285 -  ABS Wheel Speed Sensor; Front Right (G45)
            003 -  Mechanical Failure - Intermittent
00668 - Shareware Version. To Decode all DTCs
            008 - Please Register/Activate - Intermittent
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 26, 2018, 03:25:21 PM
BTW, If I vcds the immobilizer controller. There is "no reponse from controller." Is that normal?

Cheers

L
 
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on July 26, 2018, 10:27:17 PM
BTW, If I vcds the immobilizer controller. There is "no reponse from controller." Is that normal?

Cheers

L
 

I think you will find you need the Ford Pats software (Focom/Fcom or Forscan) for the Ford badged versions. This is the one bit thats different between the Sharan/Alhambra and the Galaxy. After all a Ford dealer wouldn't have VW software to allow them to code an extra key available to them.

I'm currently trying to sort a second key for mine, but it doesn't seem particularly simple to do so with only 1 key.

If you can speak to the rest of the diagnostics that would suggest it isn't the relay 109 issue, as when I've tried to connect (although this was on the petrol ones in both cases) you can't connect if the relay is in the failed state, it just times out.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on July 26, 2018, 10:30:02 PM
Hi.

crank sensor out and cleaned up. got a resistance reading of .5 k ohm across two of the pins. (haven't recorded which. will re do.) Not sure what to look for to verify if faulty.

It will take a few days to get hold of a replacement.

I now have 2 engine faults on VCDS. second one is not on pdf list of codes. (p1672) I am going to register vcds when i have recovered from the current outlay on the car!


VCDS-Lite Version: Release 1.2
Thursday, 26 July 2018, 16:03:04.


Chassis Type: FG - Ford Galaxy
Scan: 25,01,02,03,08,09,15,16,17,18,19,22,29,35,36,37,39,45,55,56,76
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine       Labels: 038-906-019-AJM.LBL
   Controller: 038 906 019 LR
   Component: 1,9l R4 EDC 0001SG  1565
   Coding: 00002
   Shop #: WSC 00020
   VCID: 729759CB2DB7
2 Faults Found:
17552 -  Mass Air Flow Sensor (G70): Open or Short to Ground
            P1144 - 35-00 -   -
18080 - Shareware Version. To Decode all DTCs
            P1672 - 35-00 - Please Register/Activate
Readiness: N/A

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes       Labels: 1J0-907-37x-ABS.LBL
   Controller: 7M3 907 379 G
   Component: ABS FRONT MK25      0102
   Coding: 0007689
   Shop #: WSC 00020
   VCID: 41F5C6075891
2 Faults Found:
00285 -  ABS Wheel Speed Sensor; Front Right (G45)
            003 -  Mechanical Failure - Intermittent
00668 - Shareware Version. To Decode all DTCs
            008 - Please Register/Activate - Intermittent


As far as i can tell the second error is the cooling fan - see this?
https://www.bba-reman.com/forums/topic88303-1-1.aspx
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on July 26, 2018, 10:40:53 PM
Also - its worth checking the wiring to the bits around the clutch area, just incase something has got damaged. The crank sensor being one possibility, not sure what else you'd find there that would stop it starting, but knowing what some of the other wiring on these is like it wouldn't surprise me if you had found another weak spot in them. The whooshing noise sounds a bit suspect to me, sure you haven't got a hose off the intake somewhere? Given theres no fluid leakage mentioned can only assume its air getting out where it shouldn't be?

Also worth checking the MAF wires while your there, Though i doubt either of the detected faults is your actual issue with the starting and cutting out. That could be relay 109 but i'd expect it to be fairly random and fail to start as well as run then cut out. Given you can fix it with a soldering iron and some fresh solder I'd pull it out anyway and check it, just a case of popping the case off and looking at the joints (any crazed or cracked appearance just remove the old solder with a sucker or some desolder braid and resolder with new, or buy another relay if you feel the need, but resoldering has worked for me)
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 27, 2018, 09:17:11 AM
Hi and thanks again for your reply and your time.

Whoosh turns out to be the main fan turning momentarily when the ignition is switched off!  Will investigate to see if it is rubbing or something which possibly triggered the fault code

I certainly agree it is possibly damage somewhere but I was pretty carefully taping everything out the way. Just bending the cables could be enough to cause a hidden break as you say. The big collection of cables that clips underneath the battery tray is a case in point. The car was running perfectly well before the clutch went and I also ran the engine whilst being towed.

I will investigate further today and gen up on testing some of the connectors. I am just hoping for that Eureka moment. It's so much easier when bits fall off or break!!

It is very hot over here so I have our market shelter set up over the car in front of the house. It has become a bit of a permanant feature and the locals are starting to talk!

Cheers

L

Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: johnnyroper on July 27, 2018, 10:29:01 AM
If I remember correctly on that particular PD engine it is not possible to damage crank sensor doing clutch etc as it is housed in front of the block, the wiring from ECU around/under battery tray is certainly a possibility though.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 27, 2018, 12:08:05 PM

Yep. unfortunately it seems unlikely to be the culprit but I will try and test it. After a shuftie at the relay, I guess I am going to have to unwrap the bundles and have a good look at everything. I'm well prepared as we had spaghetti last night :)
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: johnnyroper on July 27, 2018, 12:30:55 PM
Apart from clutch have you done anything else on the car during its lay up?
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 27, 2018, 07:54:20 PM
Yes. I have changed the crank seal whilst the flywheel was out, replaced the clutch master cylinder, which involved ripping out the whole lower facia inside the car according to Haynes. I also changed a lower ball joint, replaced the cabin filter, air filter, engine and gearbox oil change.

Nothing that should have a bearing on this problem. I am having drivers door wiring issues at the moment but agin I don't think there is a connection. (geddit?!)

I am currently thinking about the master fuse console and relay underneath as this has been disturbed frequently and a fan fault has come up. I am compiling a list of things to re check but it is my eldest daughters 14th birthday tomorrow and I promised to take her to the lake for canoeing. We have had to cancel our camping holiday this month so I need to make amends! As some of my friends foolishly think I am mechanically minded, I am helping them with their cars this weekend as well!

It's going to be something simple that has arisen as a result of the clutch work. It really wants to start!

Cheers

L













 
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: johnnyroper on July 27, 2018, 08:38:54 PM
As you have had dash apart might also be worth checking around there in case something on fuse/relay panel has been disturbed
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 28, 2018, 09:59:22 AM
Yep. just the lower panels but i plan to recheck around the main fuse board although it was left in place. I have never had reason to get to relays and never researched the peculiar plated catch at the top! Will look over weekend.

Thanks again to everyone and cheers for now. At least with the forums, we can all be baffled together :)

L
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on July 28, 2018, 11:20:55 AM
Once you have the covers off the front of the fuseboard it drops down after you remove the single screw from the top, and undo the two clips on the bottom edge (they spring off then you lift it out of the two hook like bits, there is also two locating pegs that are sprung loaded to clip into place, small flat screwdriver to hold them back is simplest way I've found to deal with them.)

Don't think its different on a lefthand drive one, assuming yours is LHD of course given your in France.

Only other thought - did you have to undo a connector that was bolted together? I can't remember offhand if the Galaxy has one like it, but quite often Ford engines will have a connector that the entire loom for the engine can be disconnected from, this will have a captive bolt in its centre to hold it together. The idea is you can remove the engine with the loom still connected to it. If you haven't got that connector in properly (either not tightened up enough, or one of the pins has come out of the plug) that may account for your issues, I've had that where it pushed out the connection to the coil pack on another car in the past, easily done particularly once the plastic has aged etc.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 28, 2018, 01:17:03 PM
Hi Brian. I have sussed the fuseboard out. I had a look at the relay and need to test it. Does the grey cover flip off to expose the contacts?

I am RHD BTW as Secondhand cars here are pretty damn expensive. Fine if you buy new as depreciation is much much lower than in UK but a nightmare if you are buying S/H. You still see French cars around here from the 80's and 90's juat for a weekly shopping trip by folks in their 80's.

I have had a good look around the lower fascia and glovebox but can't see anything untoward. The only loose connector was behind the stereo and I am sure it was for the (never fitted )CD autochanger as a couple of years ago I swapped it out to fit an MP3 adaptor. There is a loose fuse holder with an intact blade fuse but that was it.

I am going to jack up the car again and have another lookabout. Whip the battery tray out and look at that big bundle of wiring underneath. I need to get down to some component tracing and testing over the next couple of days so need to do a bit of homework.

Thanks again

L

Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 28, 2018, 01:58:13 PM
So far: Relay 109 Clicks twice and then a third time on energising ignition but not turning over engine. Clicks again on switching off.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 28, 2018, 02:23:32 PM
Sorry Brian. Forgot to answer. Further to your question. there was no screw together loom connector. As far as I remember it was just the three connectors behind battery + ECM and the starter motor cables and reverse switch on gearbox.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: Chrispb on July 28, 2018, 05:41:29 PM
So far: Relay 109 Clicks twice and then a third time on energising ignition but not turning over engine. Clicks again on switching off.
That's interesting, relay 109 supplies the power to engine ECU and sensors, engine will not start if this is faulty, they do suffer from poor solder joints and some members have just resoldered but to be honest they are not expensive.

I did ask you what the door LED was doing when operating the starter as this will cause the light flash frantically while operating the starter if the relay is faulty.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on July 28, 2018, 07:16:17 PM
Personally (relay 30 in my case but won't matter) have resoldered the points - I did buy a new one after using one from a scrapyard fusebox to initally fix my original mk1, but never ended up using it as the salvaged one lasted around 70k miles, at which point the original one went back in with resoldered joints, which lasted till the engine chewed up its piston rings (about 30k further).

Having experienced the mk2 relay failing (which it did and caused the car to cut out and refuse to start or even turn over) I've resoldered that one as well and its been fine. If you've got to the point of pulling the box apart to get to the relay, I'd resolder it to save having to get in there again too soon, as they do seem to fail regularly since your already there.

Yes the grey cover will slide off, but you need something to release the clips on the edges - i found a few small screwdrivers did that ok, then just slide the box bit away from the pins.

I don't think its that though, as you state above that the led does what would be expected to do if it was seeing the key correctly, failed relay should result in rapid flashing when trying to start.

Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 29, 2018, 04:49:34 AM
Hi Chris. I did reply to your LED question:

"The LED just comes on and goes out and stays out when starting. (The LED had never worked since I bought the car until I stripped out the door and found it hadn't been connected up." It's on for a couple of seconds.

I am discounting potential relay problem as up until today, the fusebox had never been touched. I will open it up and also probably buy a spare for future use.

SO:
I have lift pump function (audible) and fuel.
Battery v good.
Starter good and functioning.
car fires with a puff of smoke from exhaust.

Must test crank sensor properly today. There is a brass "contact" area exposed at the end. Is that normal? Doesn't look worn like an ABS sensor. As all was working normally before the gearbox strip I'd be suprised if it was that. Might order a spare today.


I have noticed the pump to brake servo pipe was dislodged whilst removing clutch pipe but i don't suppose that has a bearing on the situation.  It is certainly a swine to get back on as I thought i'd already done it.

I am also discounting recent driver door wiring problems as I doubt this would cause starting issues.

Time to lift the car up again and have another look underneath.
 
Once again, thank you all very much for your support. Sorry I haven't got a result for you as yet!

Cheers

L
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: Chrispb on July 29, 2018, 06:23:36 AM
Try starting with crank sensor unplugged before taking sensor out.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 29, 2018, 07:35:38 PM
Hi Chris

Just got in.

Tried cranking with unplugged sensor and engine didn't fire. So does that rule out the crank sensor?

Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: Chrispb on July 29, 2018, 11:35:07 PM
No but there have been instances where unplugging the sensor the engine would start using just the cam sensor, I don't think the crank sensor was faulty but the timing was out if I remember correctly
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 30, 2018, 09:30:47 AM
Ok. I will doe more routing about and definitive component testing today. I'm trying to be sytematic but I'm starting to go rounsd circles.

Today was the earliest dispatch date for various parts from my supplier so I can place an order this afternoon if i detect a fault. I haven't been anywhere near the cam sensor but I did have the sump off for the cranks seal. I wouldn't have thought this would cause a problem for the crank sensor as it is higher up.

Thanks again

L
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 30, 2018, 12:47:30 PM
Ordered a new crank sensor. Bosch not available so ordered Hella. ( Remembered the name from the spot lights on Rally cars on TV when I was a kid!) I noticed the spec was 500 Ohm and i did get a 500 ohm reading when testing the existing one.

@johnnyroper . I have just realised your original post said cam sensor not crank sensor! I will investigate this afternoon. Sun is too hot at the moment.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 30, 2018, 02:27:57 PM
Just had a look at clutch switch. The pedal is definitely in the correct position on it's shaft but the switch does not make any contact with the round raised lug on the pedal. It misses it by a few mm. What is the purpose of this switch? I assume it's not an American style ignition inhibitor to stop our colonial cousins from bumping into each other in the shopping mall car park by starting in gear?

Also, I am performing the auto scan on vcds lite, which I assumed was thorough. Should I be then going to specific controllers for more detail?

Thanks

L
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 30, 2018, 03:09:24 PM
Ok.

I would like to thank everyone for all their hints and tips to help me get me on the road.

I have one small complaint. Why didn't anyone mention to probe the air intake for the rag i stuffed in there to keep crud out, which then dropped to the bottom  when i forgot to put the upper pipe back on.

I believe I deserve the accolade "muppet of the month/year!"

I will of course be writing up the "Rag stuffed into your air intake?" How to!

I promise to stay off the forums for a while to let everyone recover.

Thanks to all again.

Leon.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: Chrispb on July 30, 2018, 05:24:06 PM
Good job it didn't start, it may have ingested the rag and caused even more problems.
I take it it's running ok then.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 30, 2018, 05:46:23 PM
Hi. Yes it started up straightaway. Clutch feels good and gearbox feels like new with gearbox shim added.

Clutch bites pretty early in pedal travel but feels very smooth and light for the first time ever.

Thanks again.

Still got to fix/replace brake servo hose and then we are ready to roll...

Cheers

L
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: johnnyroper on July 30, 2018, 05:53:27 PM
Haha that did make me chuckle at least itís all sorted and you are more familiar with you PD engine now..
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on July 30, 2018, 07:00:41 PM
Ah it makes sense now!

To answer your question about the clutch switch, You'd need one to switch off the cruise control when the clutch is pressed if you have it, so I would guess thats why you have got it?
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 30, 2018, 08:22:09 PM
Nope. No cruise control. That's why i was wondering what it was for. Anyways. gotta repair the brake servo hose at it is split at the servo end. Must've been during the never ending attempts at getting the high pressure clutch hose off. hoping to cut the broken end off and refit to angle connector.

I am certainly more familiar with the engine! Still lots of niggly faults to sort.

Cheers one and all.

L
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on July 30, 2018, 11:06:52 PM
They do split, it might have been like that before you started, even split the servo still works well enough you wouldn't notice it. Best bet is replace the section of hose as if its split at one end the other probably isn't much better. I used silicone vacuum hose on mine, far easier to get over the barbed bits than the original solid one would be.

It may be they all have the clutch switch then, can't see any other reason for it (and you know you don't have to push clutch down to get it to start unlike some later vehicles do as you've driven it).
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: Chrispb on July 30, 2018, 11:51:40 PM
A lot of cars now have a clutch switch even if no cruise, it's still wired to the PCM to reduce power while clutch is slightly pressed.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on July 31, 2018, 11:07:43 AM
Whatever the clutch switch does, it doesn't appear to touch the pedal. Maybe a part is missing that fits over the dimple at the top of the pedal. Maybe I'll make something up to fit and see if there's a difference. Job 183 on my list. Still feels weird having a car that starts!

Will get silicon hose as It was indeed split at the other end. (And probably disconnected at the valve by my fiddling, hence no vac for servo.) Looks like 12mm OD so 10mm ish internal. I'll have to bodge it for now  and order some silicon online 'cos i don't see it available in the local halfords type shops. We have one motor factor where they are unbelievably sniffy with their clientelle. The list price for a bag of 80 odd 10" cable ties was 80 EUROS!!! Needless to say I don't go there.

Off to see our English chums up the road as our friend Pam was out riding and got kicked by the horse thst was with her. Nasty break on lower leg in two places. She's out of hospital today so we are going over and I am not lying over or under the car for a few hours!

Cheers to all.

Leon

L
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on July 31, 2018, 06:47:56 PM
I've seen similar comments elsewhere from where other people have had problems in France. Not helped by most of the "professional" places having as much talent for making stuff worse than fixing things. Nor-Auto i think was the place they named, but he had been to various places and found none were any better.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: Chrispb on July 31, 2018, 10:45:50 PM
Found this piece in the popular manual, more or less says what I said.
It says the clutch and brake switches are fitted the same by pushing inwards and turning anticlockwise a quarter turn to remove, refitting is the reverse but be gentle as they do break easily as I can confirm >:([attachimg=1]
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 01, 2018, 07:27:00 PM
Brian. Many Norautos are franchises. I find they are nice enough but there are lots of gaps on the shelves of fast moving items. I did actually buy a crane from them as it was cheap ish and available. I also get the engine oil from there as it is the right spec. There is another place in the same town called Feu Vert which probably means green flame. They can be helpful but anything I need usually needs to be ordered so I might as well get exactly what I want from the internet. I get a lot of stuff from Germany very quickly but had a problem with the clutch DMF as it disappeared in the carriers system and tokk three weeks to sort a refund and get one from elsewhere.

Some of the local garages can be very good as they are often proper mechanics with corners full of anything from classic cars to the local fire brigade Unimog. This area is all farming so there are small proper engineering shops around if you look hard enough.

As to the brake switch Chris, when I took it off again just to test it, i had a hell of a job getting it back in. The inner body twists inside the outer shell and you press the switch to turn it. I just ligned up the white paint marks and it is definitely in place but definitely doesn't touch the pedal.  I might try it taped in the closed position to see if there is a difference. I went for a second tentative run around the block today and all seems OK. Brake servo is back online and as I said, the gearbox shim has really sorted R,1,2 stiffness.

Cheers

L
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 01, 2018, 07:40:35 PM
Looking in my own copy of the good book. (well spotted!) I guess that if the switch is not operating then it doesn't send a momentary signal to ECU as per item 32. Looking at Clutch page 6-3 and diag 3.6b, the dimple is visible just below the arrow. The pedal is right up against the pivot mounting and the pedal stop on the floor is lined up. Maybe there a hidden rag caught in it.....
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: Ben g mon on August 01, 2018, 08:02:33 PM
You wonít be the first to block the intake then start the car, bastard area to get to removing the stub on axle stands..... I lost a rubber glove down the intake after stupidly starting car after topping up brake fluid with the air ox and trunking offf...

Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 01, 2018, 08:16:30 PM
I suppose I was luck that one of my hens or a small child wasn't sucked in:)
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on August 01, 2018, 09:26:01 PM
Brian. Many Norautos are franchises. I find they are nice enough but there are lots of gaps on the shelves of fast moving items. I did actually buy a crane from them as it was cheap ish and available. I also get the engine oil from there as it is the right spec. There is another place in the same town called Feu Vert which probably means green flame. They can be helpful but anything I need usually needs to be ordered so I might as well get exactly what I want from the internet. I get a lot of stuff from Germany very quickly but had a problem with the clutch DMF as it disappeared in the carriers system and tokk three weeks to sort a refund and get one from elsewhere.

Some of the local garages can be very good as they are often proper mechanics with corners full of anything from classic cars to the local fire brigade Unimog. This area is all farming so there are small proper engineering shops around if you look hard enough.

As to the brake switch Chris, when I took it off again just to test it, i had a hell of a job getting it back in. The inner body twists inside the outer shell and you press the switch to turn it. I just ligned up the white paint marks and it is definitely in place but definitely doesn't touch the pedal.  I might try it taped in the closed position to see if there is a difference. I went for a second tentative run around the block today and all seems OK. Brake servo is back online and as I said, the gearbox shim has really sorted R,1,2 stiffness.

Cheers

L

I think the problem was more their practical skills - Specifically they managed to lose a special bolt off a battery clamp from the person who'd had issues with them. Wasn't a standard bolt had a special cone shape to sit on to clamp it up tight, and noone could seem to find one on the same model of vehicle (Range Rover) which was actually the same. Ended up identifying a suitable donor vehicle and they got one sent from here to France to sort it out, as they couldn't find one locally at all. I think as you say a lot of the problem is finding someone willing/able to do the work which is generally best finding a good independent who knows what they are actually doing with stuff rather than a parts fitter.

Much the same as i wouldn't pay someone to fit a battery for me anyway unless I didn't have the tools at the time, I'd buy the battery and fit it myself (and if I ended up in Halfords, which is our closest equivalent without the tools I'd rather buy the tools from them than pay them to fit it).
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 02, 2018, 12:38:28 PM
Probably would have been OK if he'd have had a Renault 4!

When we moved here in 2008. I hadmy freshly (specialist garage) prepared Discovery 1 that I thought would last forever. We had lots of problems on the way down and then a Runaway engine by the time we were 1 hour from our new home. My wife had been driving it and I followed in a 7.5 tonner with all our wordly goods. We had to evacuate the car and atand there in shock whilst it poured out more white smoke than the red arrows. The A71 Motorway ground to a halt. The fire brigade, Gendarmes and Highways people all arrived. The recovery guy arrived and diagnosed head gasket and 1000 quid to do it! I had the AA tow it back to UK and stupidly let the garage buy it off me. If only i'd have knew then what i know now! I'd have that car back tomorrow.

Getting back on topic. Speedo has packed up,Fuel guage keeps dropping to zero and barake warning has come on. Just when you think you are out of the woods :(
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 02, 2018, 01:10:05 PM
Fault code 18062.

Checking the small restrictor in the coolant reservoir last night. A bit of coolant dripped out and may have shorted the coolant sensor and caused the fault. Will disconnect  and let it dry out. May be the cause. I just did a 10km trip and it the fault started on the way back. Will investigate.

By hook or by crook we a re going canoeing tonight. I will also be glad to see the back of the spare peugeot 307 estate that a friend has kindly lent us for the last couple of months.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on August 02, 2018, 06:21:21 PM
Probably would have been OK if he'd have had a Renault 4!

When we moved here in 2008. I hadmy freshly (specialist garage) prepared Discovery 1 that I thought would last forever. We had lots of problems on the way down and then a Runaway engine by the time we were 1 hour from our new home. My wife had been driving it and I followed in a 7.5 tonner with all our wordly goods. We had to evacuate the car and atand there in shock whilst it poured out more white smoke than the red arrows. The A71 Motorway ground to a halt. The fire brigade, Gendarmes and Highways people all arrived. The recovery guy arrived and diagnosed head gasket and 1000 quid to do it! I had the AA tow it back to UK and stupidly let the garage buy it off me. If only i'd have knew then what i know now! I'd have that car back tomorrow.

Getting back on topic. Speedo has packed up,Fuel guage keeps dropping to zero and barake warning has come on. Just when you think you are out of the woods :(


Thats usually the engine bay fusebox going into meltdown, you might be able to save it if you resolder the big cables to the clamps (might need to replace the clamps, you will need to have a look).

If you need the fusebox try to pickup the genuine ford or VW one, not the pattern ones as they don't fit so easily (cable to goto the battery on mine was too short and wrong type of terminal as well).

I have a Disco 2 - you'd have probably had to have major work done to the rear chassis/boot floor as they are notorious for problems there, I know mine is getting on now, but the legendary Land Rover reliability has not impressed me!
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 03, 2018, 10:53:09 AM
Crikey Fusebox looks OK. All the connections look good.  I was hoping I have knocked or misplaced some wiring when messing about with the vacuum hose. I also had a look at the restrictor in the coolant hose and spilt some coolant so I am wondering whether that had an effect.

Fuel gauge is getting intermittent signal and brake warning light keeps coming on and speedo is dead. I wouldn't mind except for the incessant beeping as the faults keep kicking in!!

We still went canoeing yesterday and the clutch and gearbox felt great .Extremely hot today so low profile until later. I hope I can get shot of these gremlins.

I was aware of the rear end problems on the Discos. I would still have one tomorrow. At the moment I have decide to try and keep this Galaxy going for as long as possible as it's so good at everything. The kids are really fond of it as well. It will need some welding underneath doing this year.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: johnnyroper on August 03, 2018, 11:37:06 AM
This was an issue with them years ago that ford ended up changing clusters for,first off check the earth down by pedals. But it sounds very much like the issue they used to have,have a google as I am sure it was on watchdog several years back
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 03, 2018, 01:26:04 PM
Will do. Bizarre it shoud suddenly decide to play up. Bearing in mind I have had main fuse/relay board open for the first time a couple of days ago.

Well, they say it's good to have a hobby.....
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 04, 2018, 09:51:17 AM
Hi.

Couldn't find earth point near pedals. peeled carpet and removed some panels. All the earth point s higher up look good.

I will take the cluster out today and have a looksie, then follow the wiring harness.

Cheers

L
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 04, 2018, 09:55:41 AM
I had a look about and found lots of unsolved info on this issue. Starting with earthing points as suggested and look for dry joints on pcb. There is a particular 0 ohm jumper that can be bypassed/resoldered. Happened to the focus and mondeo. My galaxy should have the later cluster and doesn't have the gearbox sensor, which was supposed to avoid the fault.

Wierd it should happen now. As always I suspect ham fisted tinkering first and foremost.

Cheers

L
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on August 05, 2018, 10:41:49 PM
Which brake warning light are you getting come on? The yellow bulb failure one, the red brake fluid/handbrake one or the abs one?

I've known the boot wiring to cause all manner of weird problems (backlight on dashboard coming on when you press the brakes being one), it might be worth a check there just in case?

If its the brake fluid light bearing in mind you've had the clutch apart how does the fluid level look? might be worth a check the cap is on properly/plugged in correctly as well?
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 07, 2018, 08:31:24 AM
Hi Brian.

Sorry for delay in replying.

I put more fuel in the tank which has lessened the beeping considerably. (It wasn't empty.)

It is the red brake fluid/handbrake light is on and flashing. I am monitoring the brake fluid and clutch lines and it all seems to be OK. I will check cap again just to be on the safe side. Breake function itself feels good so I'm sure it's a false warning.

(The ABS light has been on for a couple of years as there must be a fault further in from the sensor that was replaced but that's another story!)

This is definitely strangely related to past posts by others with the same fault as Johnny had mentioned. I intend to investigate it fully and post a definitive solution in a new thread. Just don't hold your breath:)

I think I had better sort the flaky driver door wiring next as it is becoming a nuisance and may possibly be related to this issue somehow. I will also look at rear door as, although it mostly works perfectly well. I don't have any foglights or numberplate lights.

Cheers and thanks again for the all the pointers.

L

Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: johnnyroper on August 07, 2018, 09:50:50 AM
It could well be door loom related also as they cause all manner of odd electrical gremlins if shorting across circuits. To rule it in or out you could just unplug at post and see if your fault light issue changes?
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 07, 2018, 10:25:04 AM
Yes. Good idea. Will have a look later when it cools down. It would be nice to have a speedo but just having the car running is a bit of a bonus!

Cheers

L

Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: brianh on August 07, 2018, 06:03:52 PM
The lack of foglights does suggest the rear hatch loom needs some attention, even if you just get in there now and tape the wires up that would be a start.

It can be things other than the sensors that cause the abs errors (broken reluctor rings or modulator faults), given its flashing I would suspect something more wrong than the fluid level sensor. Not sure if you can do much on VCDS that would help as far as the brakes go, I've never tried personally.
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 13, 2018, 12:44:15 PM
Sorry for late reply.

I am just going to go start with the drivers door and get that sorted. Strip out the scuttle again in case something i did caused the display issues, then look at the boot hatch wiring. At the moment I am using a phone gps for speedo for our occasional short journeys. 

Oh, and the brake pad warning light  has now kicked in. Pads are new all round this year. Will have a cursory glance later.

I am officially closing this thread for now as I am due to start working on my barn roof. Hopefully when that's done I will have a dry, well lit space to work on the car this winter for the first time ever. Anyways ,it's time to give you guys a rest!!!!

Thanks to all for your excellent assistance. I will be reposting soon, hopefully with some results that others may find useful...

Cheers

L
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: mrhiviz on August 15, 2020, 12:12:18 PM
Hi All. (Assuming someone actually reads this!)

Two years later after my last post and I am preparing for another MOT/CT (Retest) and I have corrected a fair few faults. The issue with the up and down beeping fuel gauge and non working speedo was simply due to the LH ABS cable coming adrift and getting cut by the brake disc. I found it whilst changing a tyre. Why that would affect the fuel gauge I couldn't say but there you go.

A few niggles to sort and an ABS light to extinguish and it should be OK for another couple of years. I am hoping to treat it like a classic car and keep mending it as the engine is still sweet and only about 150k.

I hope all is well with everyone. stay safe.

L
Title: Re: Another non-starter after clutch strip.
Post by: SirDavidAlhambra on August 15, 2020, 11:39:48 PM
Thank u very much for the update, it is always good to know how these things work out in the end

 [GJ]