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Author Topic: EGR/Throttle body and OBDII code problems  (Read 3369 times)

Offline timroz

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  • Posts: 4
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  • Model: Alhambra Mk2
  • Spec: 2007 TDI 140 BRT
  • First Name: Tim
  • Region: South East
  • Country: United Kingdom
EGR/Throttle body and OBDII code problems
« on: November 09, 2016, 02:22:15 PM »
Hi Chaps,
Been viewing as a guest for a while and it's now time to dive in. Hopefully someone can help with the intermittent starting of my 2007 TDI 140 Alhambra.
After being rescued by the AA several times over the last few weeks (can't remember the codes but they were EGR related), I have done the following work on the car:
Replaced EGR valve (fiddly job)
Disassembled/cleaned/reassembled intake manifold (utter pain job)
Car has been running fine for about 3 weeks, then stuttering/stalling began again. Connected my trusty ELM327 wifi doodar and got the following codes:
P2102 Throttle Actuator A Control Motor - Circuit low
P2108 Throttle actuator Control Module Performance
P2100 Throttle Actuator A Control Motor - Circuit Open

So, I thought I was doing the right thing and bought a new throttle body, fitted it yesterday and Wahey! It's like a new car! So I drove it to my local friendly garage and asked them to connect their scantools (they have a Snap-On handheld unit and VCDS on a laptop). They found no error codes with either tool and the options to remap/recalibrate EGR valve and throttle were greyed out, so I thought I've fixed it finally.
However, at 5.15pm last night, going round a roundabout, the car stalled, stuttered and died. I managed to nurse it to a garage, stuck the code reader on and the same 3 codes are coming up.
Where would anyone go from here to diagnose the fault? Is it a fuse/relay? Do I need a new accelerator pedal? What about trying a new battery? At a loss really - it's been an expensive 3 weeks. Any advice would be welcomed.
Sorry a bout the long post, Tim

Offline insanitybeard

  • Greetings from Mr Chick!
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  • Model: Galaxy Mk2
  • Spec: '54 130ps TDI Ghia
  • First Name: Paul
  • Region: South West
  • Country: United Kingdom
Re: EGR/Throttle body and OBDII code problems
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2016, 02:36:47 PM »
Howdy! What engine is fitted to the vehicle- is it a 1.9 or 2.0 litre TDI? I ask because the 1.9 PD doesn't really have a throttle body, the butterfly in the EGR valve is called an 'anti shudder flap', installed simply to reduce engine shudder on shutdown, and also prevent engine runaway in extreme situations! Without looking I'm not familiar with the 2 litre engine to know if it's got a different setup with a throttle body, looking at some other info online it looks like if it's a BRT engine code it's a 2 litre 8 valve PD unit but it's not one I'm familiar with.

EDIT: Having looked a bit further the BRT 2 litre unit is still an 8 valve PD unit but it looks like one of the first PD models to have electronically controlled EGR valves and a throttle body installed:

http://volkswagen.7zap.com/en/rdw/sharan+syncro+4motion/sha/2007-475/1/131-131040/ 
« Last Edit: November 09, 2016, 03:07:50 PM by insanitybeard »
Always learning..... Often by mistakes!

Offline johnnyroper

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  • Posts: 2945
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  • Model: Galaxy Mk2
  • Spec: 02 tdi 115 ghia
  • Region: South West
  • Country: United Kingdom
Re: EGR/Throttle body and OBDII code problems
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2016, 03:50:48 PM »
The 2.0 is just a PD lump still and as above does not have a throttle body as such.

Those codes relate to the accelerator pedal,I believe it is a fairly common fault across the VAG range with the potentiometer tracks going faulty?

Offline Mirez

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  • Spec: 03 115PS Ghia
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Re: EGR/Throttle body and OBDII code problems
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2016, 04:32:44 PM »
No they relate to the thottle actuator which is not the pedel. The BRT has an electronic actuator and the codes would suggest that one of two sensors isn't reading correctly.

The drive motor has been known to have issues where it shorts out, blowing its supply fuse and flagging these codes. Check your fuses to ensure they are all intact! If rhey are then then replace the motor (and cary spare fuses until you do).

Before you do that though, since the TA is built into the EGR which you've replaced. Did you run through the adaption process after changing it? Its highly possible if you didnt that you are just hitting the limits of the OLD valve in software.
03 Ford Galaxy 1.9 TDI 115 Ghia in Spruce Green Metallic
With cream leather interior, Full Bodykit, Remapped at 145bhp, Lowered on 18's
14 VW Tiguan 2.0 TDI 177 AWD R-Line in Deep Black Pearl
With panoramic sunroof, bi-xenon headlights remapped at 205bhp.
08 Ford Transit 2.2 TDI 115 in Frozen White
With retrofitted everything except another slidey door! :)

VCDS HEX/CAN - Scans/Coding done in Wiltshire in exchange for winegums! :)

Offline insanitybeard

  • Greetings from Mr Chick!
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  • Posts: 2427
  • Thanked: 71
  • Model: Galaxy Mk2
  • Spec: '54 130ps TDI Ghia
  • First Name: Paul
  • Region: South West
  • Country: United Kingdom
Re: EGR/Throttle body and OBDII code problems
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2016, 04:41:25 PM »
So is the actuator item number 4 on the parts diagram I linked earlier? From the diagram I assumed that item 1 was the EGR valve and the throttle body/ actuator was item 4, a separate part. This is the part I was assuming that the O.P has already replaced, along with the EGR valve.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2016, 04:44:09 PM by insanitybeard »
Always learning..... Often by mistakes!

Offline Mirez

  • Pondering the next mod...
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  • Posts: 3658
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  • Model: Galaxy Mk2
  • Spec: 03 115PS Ghia
  • First Name: Mark
  • Region: South West
  • Country: United Kingdom
Re: EGR/Throttle body and OBDII code problems
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2016, 04:50:16 PM »
Yeah item 4, on some the EGR is integrated but from that it looks seperate.
03 Ford Galaxy 1.9 TDI 115 Ghia in Spruce Green Metallic
With cream leather interior, Full Bodykit, Remapped at 145bhp, Lowered on 18's
14 VW Tiguan 2.0 TDI 177 AWD R-Line in Deep Black Pearl
With panoramic sunroof, bi-xenon headlights remapped at 205bhp.
08 Ford Transit 2.2 TDI 115 in Frozen White
With retrofitted everything except another slidey door! :)

VCDS HEX/CAN - Scans/Coding done in Wiltshire in exchange for winegums! :)

Offline johnnyroper

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  • Posts: 2945
  • Thanked: 148
  • Model: Galaxy Mk2
  • Spec: 02 tdi 115 ghia
  • Region: South West
  • Country: United Kingdom
Re: EGR/Throttle body and OBDII code problems
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2016, 06:42:30 PM »
Well I didn't know that I thought all PD were similar set up.

Offline timroz

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  • Posts: 4
  • Thanked: 0
  • Model: Alhambra Mk2
  • Spec: 2007 TDI 140 BRT
  • First Name: Tim
  • Region: South East
  • Country: United Kingdom
Re: EGR/Throttle body and OBDII code problems
« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2016, 11:27:42 AM »
Hi Everyone,
Thanks for the replies, it's good to have combined knowledge at your fingertips!
Just to clarify a few things - engine is BRT version, it's done 175K miles, engine rebuild at 144K (camshaft etc), drivers door loom wiring sorted, driveshafts replaced, serviced every 6 months, so looked after well.
The EGR valve was replaced but not adapted - I haven't got VCDS (yet!).
I spoke to the friendly garage mechanics yesterday afternoon - they suggested taking the vane out of the old "throttle body"/anti-shudder flap and refitting it. Which I did last night. Cleared the codes with my ELM327 doodar, went for a 20 mile drive until the engine got warm, no codes came up.
Woke up at silly o'clock this morning and went for a 30 mile drive to get cheap diesel, drove back ok, no codes present after scanning. So, at least the car is driveable, but what lasting damage could occur without the anti-shudder flap operational?
The missus has lost confidence in the car now, so am now under a modest amount of pressure to either fix it or "get me a new one". Either way, my wallet will be crying!
I will report back over the weekend - missus is hoping to do a 500 mile round trip to Newcastle and back......

Offline johnnyroper

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  • Posts: 2945
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  • Model: Galaxy Mk2
  • Spec: 02 tdi 115 ghia
  • Region: South West
  • Country: United Kingdom
Re: EGR/Throttle body and OBDII code problems
« Reply #8 on: November 10, 2016, 11:56:34 AM »
Not sure about lasting damage with no anti shudder fitted during normal operation,if turbo expires and spews oil in to the inlet the engine will run to destruction as you will struggle to switch it off.

Having said that my 1.9 has no anti shudder as I have egr delete fitted,only thing I notice is when switching off it does shudder slightly but dipping clutch prior to switch off stops this happening.

 

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